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 Post subject: Russia attacking the UK
PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2018 6:10 pm 
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Our MI5 has pin pointed what happened to the two who were attacked by a Nerve agent in Salisbury, What action should we now take. And how long before the Opposition speak out.

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j ... apHCab5a1n Russia

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2018 6:16 pm 
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Corbyn spoke about it in PMQs earlier today.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2018 6:21 pm 
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Lighthouse wrote:
Corbyn spoke about it in PMQs earlier today.

Excellent, so the Labour party will be "breaking off Diplomatic Relations ASAP". Some hope.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2018 7:54 pm 
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What action should we take?

They executed a traitor.

As I've said elsewhere, we should have done the same with Philby and McClean.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2018 2:37 pm 
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But not by poisoning an entire town.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2018 4:17 pm 
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Anya wrote:
But not by poisoning an entire town.

Agreed and an innocent Policemen was also Poisoned as a were a couple of others. Plus if Russia now is using it's Secret Service to reach out and Murder those it considers Traitors, it means they have crossed the line. Reading today our Government is to invest more in stopping the cyber hacking, plus we may employ sanctions against Russia.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2018 6:56 pm 
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laurie 53 wrote:
What action should we take?

They executed a traitor.

As I've said elsewhere, we should have done the same with Philby and McClean.


They did not execute a traitor, they attempted and failed to murder Skirpal. Whilst at the same time killing someone else and seriously injuring others on the streets of the UK

Skirpal had already been dealt with by the Russian legal system, having been tried and sentenced to 13 years in prison for spying for the West. He was subsequently released in exchange for Russian spies held in the USA. That the Russians should then attempt to kill him comes as no surprise.

That we did not attempt to murder Philby and McClean surely indicates the difference between our democracy and the Russian State.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2018 7:30 pm 
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Anya wrote:
But not by poisoning an entire town.


unfortunately It is a fact of modern life that there are casualties in war.

Ask the people of Homs or Omagh.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:23 am 
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laurie 53 wrote:
Anya wrote:
But not by poisoning an entire town.


unfortunately It is a fact of modern life that there are casualties in war.

Ask the people of Homs or Omagh.

If a fact of modern life, then we are doomed. For in this case Russian agents launched an attack that did cause injury to others not only the intended victims, and that has to be seen as the "Pitts". It does also show however, how this so called civilised Power, is slowly sinking under the Present ruler.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:43 am 
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this so called civilised Power, is slowly sinking under the Present ruler.

"Civilisation " is in the eye of the beholder.

Russia has not changed in 500 years, and is not likely to do so any time soon.

Anyone who believes otherwise is mistaken.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 11:31 am 
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Casualties in a declared war are inevitable.

Ordinary, innocent citizens, in an ordinary English town, should not be attacked with chemical weapons that are banned even in war conditions.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:00 pm 
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Ordinary, innocent citizens,

I'm afraid ordinary innocent civilians disappeared, never to return, at Guernica.

I repeat, ask the people of Homs, Dresden, Omagh and ten thousand anonymous towns and villages worldwide.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:09 pm 
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laurie 53 wrote:
Ordinary, innocent citizens,

I'm afraid ordinary innocent civilians disappeared, never to return, at Guernica.

I repeat, ask the people of Homs, Dresden, Omagh and ten thousand anonymous towns and villages worldwide.

It might be I am slow, on the uptake, but you expand as for example "Dresden". Are you referring to the last war?

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 5:28 pm 
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laurie 53 wrote:
this so called civilised Power, is slowly sinking under the Present ruler.

"Civilisation " is in the eye of the beholder.

Russia has not changed in 500 years, and is not likely to do so any time soon.

Anyone who believes otherwise is mistaken.

Not quite sure where you're coming from with that. There have been profound changes in Russia within the last century - notably the Bolshevik Revolution. OK - you can argue that that only replaced one type of despotism with another but what took off under Lenin and reached its height under Stalin resulted in the deaths and miserable imprisonment of millions of people, mostly innocent. The Gulag Archipelago by Alexander Solzhenitsyn, a man who suffered and observed what was going on under the system, shines a light on the regime. Then along comes Mikhail Gorbachev, glasnost and perestroika, followed by the fall of the Soviet Union.
Now we have an ex KGB thug in charge but even so, the Russian people enjoy much more freedom than they ever did under Stalin!

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 7:46 pm 
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I repeat, anyone who doubts that Russia is, as she has always been, is still ruled by a Czar is mistaken.

It was Russian who first said that Russia will always be ruled by the knout.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:23 pm 
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Russia IS changing. Could you imagine this in Stalin's day? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pussy_Riot
Ordinary Russians are recognising their right to protest. At one time the slightest whisper against the state would have got you in the Lubyanka, a Gulag or a bullet in the back of the neck. It's not like that any more. Sure it's still got some way to go but it IS getting there! Just look at all the Russian tourists that you now meet in many holiday resorts favoured by Europeans. You didn't see this during the cold war. When I was in Egypt about ten years ago, the hotel was full of them!

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:51 pm 
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Laurie,

In what way was Omagh involved in a 'war' ?

Dave.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 9:38 am 
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The other Dave. wrote:
Laurie,

In what way was Omagh involved in a 'war' ?

Dave.


Ask the relatives of those who died.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 10:22 am 
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I am not aware that Salisbury had declared war. Against anyone.

Still puzzled. If the two Ruskies coated the door handle with Novichok, how did they not get it on themselves?


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 10:58 am 
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I am not quite clear how this "Door handle" investigation came up? Skripal and daughter appear to have been "Sprayed" as they sat in the park. Thereafter the assassins dumped the bottle nearby, knowing what it contained and fled the scene back to Heathrow. Their confidence on getting from London to Salisbury and back on a weekend, by train, demonstrates that they were not aware of British culture as no Englishman would dream of trying to catch a train on a weekend! Unless you were a Bus enthusiast.
Round here, Greater Anglia (Couldn't run a bath) have 42 of the next 52 weekends trainless. They take the blame, but Network Rail should shoulder some.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 12:01 pm 
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*am not aware that Salisbury had declared war. Against anyone[/youtube]"

This obsession with declaring war is a myth. I cannot recall any war being declared since 1941?

Does anybody believe that the Korean conflict was not a war, or Vietnam?

Ask the guys who fought at Goose Green, or in Helmand province if they thought they were in a war. I certainly did when I was in Ulster and the Gulf,.

For thirty years between 1956 and 1993 I, and thousands of others, was engaged in active live operations against enemies of the state. Those operations are still going on.

We are all at war, every time we notice an unattended shopping bag.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 12:09 pm 
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tuesdays child wrote:
I am not quite clear how this "Door handle" investigation came up? Skripal and daughter appear to have been "Sprayed" as they sat in the park.


The police say that the nerve agent was on their front door handle.

How it got there without contaminating those who placed it is a mystery. How such a hazardous substance could be brought into the country at all is unknown. I doubt we will ever know the truth.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 12:28 pm 
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Lighthouse wrote:
tuesdays child wrote:
I am not quite clear how this "Door handle" investigation came up? Skripal and daughter appear to have been "Sprayed" as they sat in the park.


The police say that the nerve agent was on their front door handle.

How it got there without contaminating those who placed it is a mystery. How such a hazardous substance could be brought into the country at all is unknown. I doubt we will ever know the truth.

They tell us that it is made from two separate ingredients which in themselves are quite harmless but when they are mixed they are lethal.
Do we always believe what they tell us?
In the words of my late mother, "They say are big liars".

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 6:32 pm 
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Laurie,

..Ask the relatives of those who died...

Do you mean the relatives who were killed by a bunch of terrorists ?

Please, let us not dignify this atrocity, and the acts of the animals involved in it, with the name 'war'.

Dave.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 8:27 pm 
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Purwell wrote:
Lighthouse wrote:
tuesdays child wrote:
I am not quite clear how this "Door handle" investigation came up? Skripal and daughter appear to have been "Sprayed" as they sat in the park.


The police say that the nerve agent was on their front door handle.

How it got there without contaminating those who placed it is a mystery. How such a hazardous substance could be brought into the country at all is unknown. I doubt we will ever know the truth.

They tell us that it is made from two separate ingredients which in themselves are quite harmless but when they are mixed they are lethal.

This would appear to be substantially true - but this article seems to suggest that the process is a bit more complex than that. It would appear that this is certainly not something that anybody, even with a good knowledge of chemistry, can knock up in a laboratory with normal facilities. https://www.newscientist.com/article/21 ... sia-do-it/

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